why not look into getting a stick clip instead?

Starting sport routes with a pad? That seems awfully inconvenient on the approach and some trails I’ve seen. Wouldn’t a stick-clip do the same job for smaller/lighter/cheaper?

• I give a thumbs up for the Black Diamond DropZone, Misty Mountain Highlander, Flashed Ninja, Organic Fullpad, and the Revolution AK Pad.
• I give a thumbs down to the Bittersweet Single-/Double-Wide, BlueWater Sharma System, and Mad Rock Mad Pads.

You don’t think a stick clip is cheating?

is that a serious question or are you trolling? does it matter what i think? if you think its cheating, then don’t w/ the stick clip. it was just a suggestion. my guess is that after hauling up the crashpad to the crags a few times, you’ll reconsider.

i’ve used the DropZone pad on a trip and liked it alot.

Hey Jon, A stick clip is perfectly fine. I actually work for Flashed Bouldering and Trango. Whether you want to use a stick clip or crash pad, you should check out The Squid stick clip from Trango. It allows you to clip and unclip pretty easy. Additionally, we have some pretty nice crash pads here at Flashed. The Ninja being probably the lightest. Shoot me an email through LargeSquare if you have any questions.

Stickclip = Cheating? At the end of the day it all boils down to what you can live with. As fun and addictive as this pursuit of ours is, in the end it doesn’t really matter. It doesn’t bring world peace nor feed the hungry nor cures cancer nor fixes our country’s political machine.

If you strongly feel it’s cheating to use a stick clip, then go without. Personally, I rarely use one (I can still count the times on just a couple of hands) but I don’t feel that it’s cheating. However, you’re arguing ethics about bolted lines in the first place; it’s not like we’re bolting on lead with hand drills. Are your quickdraws pre-clipped?

You should get into free soloing, because then you don’t need any gear and no one will accuse you of cheating, except maybe cheating death, but he always levels the field sooner or later.

But in all seriousness a bouldering pad might be nice to rest and picnic on, but unless you really need one (for…bouldering) carrying them around gets old fast. I agree with these guys, just grab a stick clip from MDUB.

any recommendations on a stick-clip or are they all the same pretty much?

I was kind of kidding with the clip stick cheating comment (not completely—I did want to see people’s opinions about them). Sorry if I offended anyone. I will look into getting one. I have felt nervous at times getting to that first clip and wished I had a bouldering pad. And I have had approaches that I can see them being annoying for, but most approaches I’ve been to haven’t been that tough a of a scramble. Thank you guys for your advice.

no offense taken here. my thoughts are the same as neuroshock’s. it only matters whether ‘you’ think its cheating, not me or anyone else. its an argument that can go on forever, and not one i wish to partake in.

i used to have an Epic stick clip – don’t recommend it as its finicky with the type of carabiner you use.

i currently use a Squid, it takes some practice but works fine for me.

3 options for a stick-clip: (ordered in decreasing difficulty of use)

- Find a long stick near the route and learn how to use that (there are tips/tricks. some use tape, some use pebbles, some use knots)

- Buy a painter’s pole, squeeze clamp, and a hose clamp (Home Depot/Menards/Builder’s Square)

- Buy a painter’s pole and the Trango squid.

Hey all,

Here’s the link for the Squid. I learned how to use it for clipping and un-clipping in about 3 tries. We are getting a bunch in here within the next week. I would save your money buying a pole from us or a dealer and hit up Home Depot.

http://trango.com/prod.php?id=14

Hope this helps.

Man you guys covered this topic from soup to nuts in only 4 hours.

I would only add that if you feel unsafe clip it, don’t. I’ve in ultra sketch situations. I tried to get a clip before I went to the red one time, but I couldn’t find one in the city. Moosejaw didn’t even know what I was talking about. P.S. It was for Miguel. hehe.

ah Zac, you had to out me like that

Jon—

If you are still contemplating on using a crash pad, Sandra and I had used the “Mad Pad” by Mad Rock (pros = thick pad & good protection. cons = watch out for potentially twisting an ankle, if you so happen to fall wrongly on its’ edge). click here

If you go the stick clip route, the “Superclip” is also a good commercial stick clip (and simple to use). click here

Anyways, good of you to post even w/ “the loaded question.” Hmmmmm…..Miguel is this you? J/K “Jon.”

J

Yeah Miguel even had Miles pick up the Squid for him at Erewhon to further disguise his identity.

haha, no I am not Jon. Jon is Jon. I don’t know Jon :-)

I have the Squid, but wish I had bought the SuperClip instead. I always bring it with me on trip, but use it only when I do not feel confident about the climb. Since I am a big wimp and only lead climbs I am decently sure about, I have used it only once so far – and boy am I glad I did on that climb :-)

I thought that’s why you always brought me along on the trips. Human stick clip!

Getting back to crash pads (for bouldering), I bought the fat bastard and it works great, good price too. It’s pretty thick but does not cover as much area as others. You can check it at the airport with out an up-charge too.

Stickclipping is not an ethics issue, it is a style issue. And in the world of style I know of no-one who dismisses a stickclipper as anything other than judicious. In the old Stonemaster/Gritstone days (way pre-me) stickclipping was what you did. No-one was trying to prove anything by risking a bone-crushing fall. And most climbers would confine their efforts to routes they knew were safe and within their abilities.

Before I forget… Generally stick clipping should be done at the second bolt, not the first. It’s a second bolt fall that is the most hazardous.

ZAC: I’ve flown with most of the above mentioned (in my post) crash pads and haven’t yet (knock on wood!) had to pay any up-charges.

tom: On most sport routes I’ve seen or climbed the first bolt is the main issue, if any. The second one is usually fine if the climber and belayer know what they’re doing. ‘course, I suppose that’s a presumption that I can’t accurately make.

Woa, cool Neuro.

How do you stick clip the second bolt on a route? That has to be on average 20+ ft above ground. I’ve never seen or heard of that. I’d imagine if the route hasn’t been bolted by a total tard the second bolt should be placed pretty well.

If this horse isn’t already dead, I’m going to beat it some more. We borrowed Miguel’s Squid last week (thanks dude!) and used it with a painter’s pole from Home Depot. Though some members of our group (cough, Max, cough) weren’t often terribly keen on clipping first bolts, it came in handy in many situations.

Clipping in took zero practice and was very quick and I’m not even sure we were doing it right. We did find that it was easy to backclip even though we thought through the direction each time. That may have had to do with clipping, then having the belayer and climber walk around each other or something. I think we got it down by the end of the week.

Unclipping was slightly trickier, but we made it work. Only had to once, but we recovered one of Max’s draws, so it saved $15… or at least $3 for a bail biner… or at least Max’s ankles if he had tried to unclip, then downclimb. One question for others that have unclipped: is this safe to do with wiregates? In the process of unclipping the draw, we seemed to bend the wiregate past the back of the biner a couple times. His draw looked ok after we got it down, but it made us a little uneasy. Were we doing something wrong? Is the Squid intended for solid gate draws primarily?

Also, can anyone describe the process for clipping in a rope to a fixed (or already hung) draw using the Squid? We never needed to do this, but it might have been nice for the perma-draw-equipped routes that Max got on. I suspect it involves the smaller swinging double-arm-thing lower on the device.

Thanks to all for your input.

trango’s instruction video

see 2:35 for clipping the rope to already hanging quickdraws.

Cool, thanks Mike. That probably would have been good to watch before we left, but as I said, we made do just fine. (LOL at “let me show you how to kill yourself” in the vid. Hilarious.)

Turns out we were using the correct unclipping technique and in the vid he uses a wiregate draw, so I’m still wondering about our gate situation. Essentially, in the process of wedging the body/spine of the biner into the Squid, the gate got cranked hard enough that it bent to the side of the spine. I didn’t really see a way to not pull as hard on the pole, while still having the biner in the device tightly enough to extract it. FYI, the draw in question was an OP, specifically this model I believe.